TV Watercooler

The Green Man Festival uses illegal unpaid workers.

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The Green Man Festival want people to pick up litter for them. Set hours, hard work, No pay, just a free ticket to the Festival on offer. clearly work that should be paid the legal minimum, but this has an added twist - you have to pay a deposit to secure your right to work unpaid, and there's no guarantee you'll get it back if you decide not to do the work:

The details are on this page:

http://www.greenman.net/info/working-green-man/1566

Working at Green Man

We are currently recruiting volunteer stewards and litter pickers and for experienced paid bar staff. To apply please see the job descriptions below and then fill out the relevant online application form.

Litter Picker's Applications

We are also looking for hardworking Litter Pickers at the Festival. This is a more mobile and hands on opportunity, than Stewarding, to help keep things tidy and ensure as much as possible is recycled. You’ll need to work a total of 20 hours, during the festival days, as 5 four hour shifts, with a meal before each shift.

There is also then the opportunity to make some money on the final site clearance in the week after the festival. Please specify on the application form, including your available dates.

You will need to upload a passport style photo, you are also required to pay a deposit of £125 to secure your place, which will be returned to you if you are not accepted, cannot make the festival, for a good reason, or once you complete all your shifts.

To apply to be a Litter Picker at this year’s festival please fill in the application from here.

If you have any further questions please contact johncblove@hotmail.com

So are you guaranteed to get this "deposit" back?

I asked John Love:

Dear John,

I am writing to ask about your Litter picker positions at the Festival to ask about the £125 deposit required to secure the place. Can I ask - under what circumstances would this deposit not be returned? If I am chosen to do this work and cannot make it after all, would my deposit be returned?

Many thanks

The conditions are already included on the web site page; http://www.greenman.net/info/working-green-man/1566

"You will need to upload a passport style photo, you are also required to pay a deposit of £125 to secure your place, which will be returned to you if you are not accepted, cannot make the festival or once you complete all your shifts. "

Hope this clarifies things, John

Hi John, many thanks, I was wondering what would happen if I can't make all my shifts though - do I need to to get my money back?

You will be committing to the 5 shifts, although previously, some people through sickness or family disasters have been unable to complete them. In these circumstances I have been understanding and refunded all or part.
However, on other ocassions I have tracked down and ejected those who just turned up just to register then bunked off.
Regards, John

Hi John - but if I signed up for 5 shifts and then decided not to do some, would I be refunded?

No one asks so many questions about bailing out.
I need reliable people who, barring catastrophe, are up for the whole task.
I'm getting the feeling that you're not fully committed to this and perhaps maybe you should give it a miss then.

Regards, John

Many thanks John but it seems to be a fair enough question - does everyone get their deposit returned whether they turn up or not?

No reply.

A very dodgy set up, and if HMRC looked at that to see whether these people are under an obligation to do work, I can't imagine this "deposit" idea will count in Green Man's favour...

If it wasn't for the ludicrous 'deposit' I would have thought this was quite a good idea. Free festival attendance in return for some litter-picking seems, on the face of it, a fair exchange.

But since an adult ticket is £120 it appears to be cheaper NOT to pick up the litter.

Weirdos

I think I'd rather have the cash they should be paying and decide whether I want to spend it on a ticket or not. I think the government would like the tax as well.

It's been the exact same deal at Glastonbury over the past few years, there were a high number of volunteers who just buggered off after a couple of hours, never to be seen again.

That's what volunteers do though Lulu, they come and go of their own accord - if the organisers want people to commit to stay and do work at their commercial event then they have to give up a little bit of their pofit, put their hands in their pockets and shovel a little money at those who have earned it.

I did a job like this 1988??( i think) at the 'Festival of London' in Alexandra palace.
The festival was a disaster, as the organizers kinda of forgot to market it, but i got 35 quid a day and free meals and tickets.
It was great fun.


I agree with AP, if the organizers want to be so controlling they should pay the litter pickers/stewards.
And as for the 'fee'..absolute bollocks!

P-re-cise-ly. Caused so many problems at Glasto that the few volunteer bar workers remaining were on 12 hr plus shifts without breaks or food a few years ago

I asked HMRC about this:

Please can you tell me whether the minimum wage is likely to be due under these circumstances: A music festival (not a charity) is recruiting volunteers to work as litter collecters. They will be given set hours to do the work and, if they complete their shifts, they will be given a ticket to enter the festival (worth £120). Before being accepted to do this, all volunteers must pay a deposit of £125 which will only be returned if they do all their shifts (or sickness/unavoidable circumstances intervene).

And received the following reply:

"From the information you have provided, it is very likely that the people you are refering to would be classed as workers and National Minimum Wage should be paid".

If you have arrived here via a Google Search of the Green Man Festival, have worked at the Green Man Festival as an unpaid worker in any capacity and would like to make a claim for the money they should have been paid, please feel free to PM me. And if anyone has worked there I'd like to know more, whether you make a claim or not. Thanks.

This isn't a new thing. As a younger man I considered parting with a deposit to be a volunteer at festival.

I genuinely don't see how organisers get round the problem of unskilled worker requirements at festivals. If you pay them, they'll still use it as a free way into the festival before bunking off and not doing the work. Asking people to pay a deposit is pretty much the only way I can see that ensures that you protect yourself against people abusing free festival entry. I reckon most festivals would act fairly pragmatically if volunteers were genuinely ill/unable to continue work.

If it's the volunteering that's the problem, then yes, they should pay NMW, but they'd still need to ask for a deposit. EDIT - I do think they should pay the though, but the deposit is a necessary evil.

I'm not quite sure why you've gone after this one FF. Even looking at the volunteering aspect, it's pretty easy to see the rewards for the workers. They don't work full shifts which means that they get to enjoy the festival. There are other perks too - like secure/private camping and free meals. But it seems to be the deposit angle you're pursuing.

Hi Boz fair points. However if these people are doing real work then why should they not get paid, as well as get the other perks? I guess the way to get around the problem of people promising to volunteer and then bunking off is simply to do the reight thing - pay them - and also take a deposit then. If they don't do their shifts, remove their staff entry pass and keep the deposit